well, i installed camarades today. http://mattvideocam.camarades.com/ I have to see if it's going to be on much or at all useful. I dont chat much at all, it seems. but at least icq is back on my new laptop. im sitting in the waitroom at the gyn doctor waiting for g. and to hear what the plan is. 5 yr ago this doc did good things, better than all the others, so i have high hopes.